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Best panerai submersible watches

12 Best Panerai Submersible Watches (Perfect For Adventures!)

Posted on by Daniel Louwrens

Panerai. The name conjures images of Sylvester Stallone and Arnie sporting these statement pieces with arms the size of, well, action movie stars. With that classic cushion case and the distinctive crown guard, it’s rather easy to spot the Submersible and see why it’s such an iconic timepiece. 

The proudly oversized diver comes in various forms and iterations for you to pick and choose from. In recent years, Panerai has even dabbled in precious metals…

About Panerai Submersible Watches

The Panerai Submersible fits into the catalog as the hardcore diver, being able to withstand a respectable 300m of water depth. Distinctively Panerai, the smallest in the contemporary catalog, measures a robust 42mm in diameter. 

While the Submersible used to be a steel diver only, in recent years, the company has begun experimenting with different case materials. Today, you’ll find a Submersible fashioned from yellow gold, Carbotech (composite material based on carbon fiber), and even bronze for that vintage flair. 

Other recognizable features include the patented crown guard and large sword hands, and keeping with a ‘yesteryear’ theme, all the date features lack a Cyclops. 

Panerai is also fond of partnering with other brands to release special editions, like the ‘Submersible S Brabus Blue Shadow Edition’ produced in conjunction with the German engineering company known for making ridiculously fast (and large) Mercedes AMGs and boats. It seems to fit the overarching philosophy of Panerai perfectly. 

History of Panerai Submersible Watches

Panerai itself hardly needs an introduction, but in case you are in need of one, the Italian company (Officine Panerai) finds its origin in 1860 at the hands of Giovanni Panerai. Initially, some models (like the Radiomir) were manufactured by Rolex (yes, that Rolex), while Panerai helped with the design. 

The largest client Panerai had in the 90s was the Italian Navy, and when the Navy eventually stopped purchasing Panerais, it created a problem, a rather large one. But a plan was looming back at the Panerai HQ… Why not sell to civilians?

After producing a limited run of 700 Luminors for the Italian market, and as the story goes, Mr. ‘Sly’ Stallone himself was completely in love with the Luminor the first time he saw it in 1995 that he purchased one for himself and his peer. The peer in question was Richemont CEO Mr. Johann Rupert, who, after spending some time with the Luminor, decided to buy Panerai. Not a watch, but the entire company. 

Eventually, the Submersible saw daylight in 1998. Initially, it was a revised Luminor with some diving attributes added, like the “L’Egiziano” bezel found on a watch that Panerai produced for the Egyptian Navy back in 1956. 

Since then, it’s been a mainstay in the lineup, and while the size certainly creates an intimidating demeanor, it’s loved by collectors and enthusiasts alike. 

Even my mother likes it, weirdly. 

Other Notable Panerai Watches

The first words that come to mind when thinking about Panerai, unfortunately, are size, heft, and “Way too big for me!”. This is rather disappointing since there is way more to their models than pure size and heft. 

The Radiomir is perhaps the most famous of their offerings which was introduced as the ref. 3646 in the 1940s. The Radiomir sports a large cushion-shaped case, a dial with luminescent numerals and indexes, wire lugs, and the distinctive four large Arabic numerals design. These were originally used by the Royal Italian Navy but became available to the public later on. 

The Luminor finds its origin in 1949 when Giuseppe Panerai designed a new luminous material that was less destructive than tritium-based substances called Luminor. The Luminor also has its own distinctive features, like the patented crown guard. The Luminor Due is a more versatile option, usually featuring a smaller case, and in recent years, Panerai has experimented with colors and finishing methods with this line. 

The 12 Best Panerai Submersible Watches

1. Panerai Submersible Steel Black Dial (ref. PAM02683)

1. Panerai Submersible Steel Black Dial (ref. PAM02683)

We kick the list off with a bang. The PAM02683 is constructed in steel, as many believe all divers should be. However, it’s elevated with the addition of a ceramic anti-clockwise rotating bezel graduated for time-elapsed diving, 

The deep black dial is home to the subtle use of light blue on the ‘SUBMERSIBLE’ and ‘300m/1000ft’ scriptures and the small seconds hand. Other recognizable features of the Submersible are present, like the skeletonized sword hands and the patented crown guard. 

Within the waterproof case sits the P.900 caliber, which is presumed to be the OP XXXIV caliber with a new name. The self-winding movement offers 3 days (or 72 hours) of power reserve.

2. Panerai Submersible Carbotech™ (ref. PAM02231)

2. Panerai Submersible Carbotech™ (ref. PAM02231)

If you prefer to sport a stealthy Panerai, perhaps the PAM02231 fashioned from Carbotech™, which is a composite material based on carbon fiber and also features a black Titanium caseback. The dark case is matched with a similar shade on the ceramic uni-directional bezel.

Similar to the aforementioned model, it has a black bezel with the same touches of light blue on the ‘SUBMERSIBLE’, ‘300m/1000ft’ scriptures, and the small seconds hand. To finish off, the 42mm Submersible is the patented crown guard, which, in case you didn’t know, was featured on early Luminor models back in the 40s and 50s, and the locking lever allows for an even tighter seal. 

3. Panerai Submersible Bianco (ref. PAM02223)

3. Panerai Submersible Bianco (ref. PAM02223)

Something that most Paneristi (fans of Panerai) know is that you don’t often find models with a white dial, which is a shame since it creates a gorgeous timepiece. The PAM02223 sports the recognizable 42mm Submersible case matched with a white-on-white dial earning it the nickname “Bianco”. 

Unlike the two previous models, there is no ‘pop of color’ on this dial. Subtle black lines encompass the hour markers and skeletonized sword hands. Also, parting from the ceramic bezel pattern we’ve seen up until now, we have a brushed steel anti-clockwise rotating bezel with a graduated scale. The P.900 caliber, along with its reliable three-day power reserve, takes care of timekeeping duties. 

4. Panerai Submersible QuarantaQuattro ESteel™ Verde Smeraldo (ref. PAM01287)

4. Panerai Submersible QuarantaQuattro ESteel™ Verde Smeraldo (ref. PAM01287)

The world we live in is filled with eco-friendly options and electric cars. There is even an electric Hummer now, and in case you do drive one of those and want a fitting timepiece, perhaps the Submersible QuarantaQuattro ESteel™ Verde Smeraldo is the perfect option. 

The steel used for this reference is constructed from eSteel™, a recycled steel offering. In fact, 52% of the total weight of the watch is recycled, or 72 grams of the 137 grams. Sticking with eco-friendliness, the Submersible sports a dark green dial, ceramic bezel insert, and strap made from recycled PET.

Apart from these green features, the Submersible is identical to others in the line-up, featuring skeletonized sword hands and a distinctive crown guard.  

5. Panerai Submersible BMG-TECH™ (ref. PAM02692)

5. Panerai Submersible BMG-TECH™ (ref. PAM02692)

If you aren’t exactly green, why not go for the real Hummer? Or, in this situation, the PAM02692. The 47mm case is a significant increase from the models featured earlier but isn’t steel like the Hummer (probably). 

The ‘BMG’ in the name refers to the ‘bulk metallic glass’ used to construct the case. Designed to give you the look and feel of regular steel with plenty of upgrades, such as increased resistance to scratches and lighter weight. 

BMG is an alloy with a disordered atomic structure produced when the high-pressure and high-temperature injection process is paired with a rapid cooling effect, which stops the mineral from settling in an ordered pattern. The end result? A light and robust material. 

Back to the PAM02692! It features a deep blue dial matched with the large white hour markers and skeletonized sword hands. Finishing the robust feel is a thick rubber strap for those oceanic endeavors up to 300m below sea level.   

6. Panerai Submersible Bronzo (ref. PAM00968)

6. Panerai Submersible Bronzo (ref. PAM00968)

Bronze is a material we rarely see in the watch world, unfortunately, and only certain companies can pull it off, if we’re being honest. The first bronze Submersible (named the Bronzo) was released as the PAM382 in 2011 and instantly became a fan favorite. The fourth iteration of bronze Submersibles was released as the PAM00968, limited to merely 1,000 pieces. 

Unlike the earlier Bronze offerings, the newer one featured a ceramic bezel insert as well as a thinner case thanks to the P.9010 movement. But if you are capable of benching 415lb, don’t worry; the case still measures a whopping 47mm in diameter. 

A linear brush finish matched with the matte dark brown dial and natural patina the copper offers creates a distinctive design you won’t be able to find just everywhere. 

7. Panerai Submersible Goldtech™ (ref. PAM02164)

7. Panerai Submersible Goldtech™ (ref. PAM02164)

What about a bit more bling? The PAM02164 is fashioned from Goldtech™, which is different from regular gold thanks to the addition of copper and platinum. These additions create a unique aesthetic while also extending the lifeline of the case. 

The 42mm gold case is matched with skeletonized gold hands with matching applied hour markers. Unlike other offerings on the list, the bling is properly emphasized by displaying a polished finish compared to the brushed finish we typically see on Panerais. 

Despite this, the timepiece retains its diving capabilities of 300m of water resistance thanks to the golden trademarked crown guard. Behind the DLC-coated screw-down caseback beats the P.900 caliber offering a robust 3-day power reserve. 

8. Panerai Submersible Marina Militare Carbotech™ (ref. PAM02979)

Back to a stealthy approach, the PAM02979 is the perfect offering to fit the bill. That said, a 47mm case might not be stealthy to some, but those who love the brand know what to expect. Fashioned from the Carbotech™ with a circular brush finish, it does look like something out of a military film. 

The dial also features the ‘Marina Militare’ scripture, something we don’t see very often. This symbolizes the relationship between Panerai and the Italian Navy, and watches with this scripture are highly sought-after thanks to limited production numbers. 

A matte black dial displays the time, the date, and a small seconds at the 9 o’clock position. Matched with a black rubber strap to really hit the dark theme home, and unlike other models on this list, it is powered by the P.9010 caliber, an evolution of the P.9000 but still offers the distinctive 72-hour power reserve.  

9. Panerai Submersible Forze Speciali (ref. PAM02239)

9. Panerai Submersible Forze Speciali (ref. PAM02239)

The PAM02239 offers an improvement in functionality compared to other models with the addition of a chronograph and a ‘Time to Target countdown’ function. This function, as the name suggests, would time the arrival of ‘the target’ – man, you gotta love a watch company that is so disgustingly itself. 

Inspired by the elite Italian Forze Speciali (Special Forces), the Forze Speciali features a 47mm case constructed in DLC-coated titanium. A blue ceramic bezel insert, along with hits of yellow on the outer perimeter of the dial, provides visual intrigue in case the size wasn’t enough. 

For such a ‘war themed’ watch, it remains rather symmetrical, with a chronograph subregister at the 3 o’clock position and the small seconds displayed at 9 o’clock. The incredible functionality of this timepiece is thanks to the in-house P.9100/R movement, which still offers that all-mighty 72-hour power reserve.  

10. Panerai Submersible Luna Rossa (ref. PAM01039)

10. Panerai Submersible Luna Rossa (ref. PAM01039)

Panerai has been known to sponsor teams and collaborate with companies, and one of the contemporary offerings is the PAM01039, produced in collaboration with the Luna Rossa Prada Pirelli Team as they head into the American Cup. 

Sporting similar wearing dimensions as other Panerais at 47mm in diameter but is finished in black Carbotech™ along with a matching Carbotech™ bezel. Setting it apart even further from the rest is the fact that it’s the first GMT on the list. The functionality of which is displayed in an enthralling nature thanks to the red GMT hand contrasting greatly against the matte Carbotech™ dial. 

Other than this subtle crimson hint, this Submersible is no different from the rest with its patented crown guard and lug profile. 

11. Panerai Submersible Mike Horn Edition (ref. PAM00984)

11. Panerai Submersible Mike Horn Edition (ref. PAM00984)

Mike Horn is a South African-born Swiss professional explorer who is known for some amazing feats, like a 6-month solo journey around the equator without any motorized transport. Fitting that a hardcore watch company would make him a hardcore watch for all his adventures, and so, the PAM00984 sees daylight. 

The case, crown guard, bezel, and case back are all fashioned from EcoTitanium™, which strap is made of recycled titanium – I’m sensing a theme here. 

This design is perhaps the furthest from the rest on the list due to the omission of a ceramic bezel insert, but it does create an understated look to this limited timepiece. The case and lugs are finished with a polish method, whereas the bezel seems to be sandblasted, which is a fitting metaphor for an explorer wearing a watch worth well above $10,000. 

Classic Panerai features remain like the 47mm size and well-known crown guard. The hour markers and hands are also handsomely filled with luminous material, creating a clean and legible dial in the dark. 

12. Panerai Submersible S Brabus Black Ops Edition (ref. PAM01240)

12. Panerai Submersible S Brabus Black Ops Edition (ref. PAM01240)

The partnership between Brabus and Panerai is one that just makes sense. In case you don’t know, Brabus is brash. Assertive. They design the types of cars to wake the neighborhood but cocoon the driver in German luxury. Remind you of anything? Personally, I see Panerai as such, not making any apologies for who or what it is. 

Inspired by the Brabus “Shadow Black Ops” series of boats, the PAM01240 was the first of the collaboration between the two companies, and it went hard. A 47mm Carbotech™ case paired with a fully skeletonized P.4001/S caliber which creates visual intrigue like no other on the list.

Red accents on the time and GMT hands, date aperture, and small seconds sub-register create a sporty feel while the flipside of the case reveals the off-center oscillating weight finished in tungsten which is bound to create a better wearing experience. 

Other than the 3-day power reserve we expect from the Submersible at this point, it also offers a world-time function, a GMT, and a power reserve. Really, this is all things to all those who often travel in their 1,200-horsepower boat. Or car. 

Conclusion

I was never fond of Panerai, to be completely honest. I could never really understand their overarching philosophy. Doing a ton of research and looking at multiple of their current and vintage offerings has changed that completely. 

I do, however, love anyone and everything that’s so in and of itself that they become predictable. How many things in your life are so dependable that it becomes predictable? 

What can you expect from your Submersible? Well, you can get steel, gold, carbon fiber, and even bronze. It’ll be big, chunky, long-lasting, and will always put a smile on your face as you know you bought a watch to suit you.  You’re unapologetically you, and so is your Submersible. 

do tissot watches hold their value

Do Tissot Watches Hold Their Value? (Read BEFORE You Buy!)

Posted on by Daniel Louwrens

To many, Tissot is the entry point to mechanical Swiss watches, and what a place to start! Known for pushing innovation and design, all while listening to their fanbase. In recent years, hits like the PRX, PRX Chronograph, and Gentleman have brought Tissot to the forefront of affordable Swiss luxury. 

But does this translate to a good second-hand value price? There are plenty of stories of Rainbow Daytonas selling for five times retail value, but you’d be hard-pressed to find a Tissot pull off the same stunt. 

Is that because you don’t hear about these sales, or do they simply not exist? Do Tissot watches actually hold their value? 

About Tissot Watches

Tissot (or Tissot SA) finds its origin in Le Locle, Switzerland, in 1853 when it was founded by Charles-Félicien Tissot and his son, Charles-Émile Tissot. After turning their home into a small factory, the father-son duo acted upon their watchmaking endeavor before Charles-Emile Tissot left to sell their savonnette pocket watches in the Russian Empire. 

Some of its first achievements include the first mass-produced pocket watch, the first pocket watch to display two time zones, and Tissot was one of the first companies to employ anti-magnetic technology in their wristwatches. 

As you can see, Tissot has always been known to push the boundaries a bit. While they might not have been seen in the same light as The Crown or Patek Philippe, they are proud of who they were and who they currently are. 

In 1971, Tissot introduced the Astrolon, aka IDEA 2001. While the name would make you believe the watch has to do with astronomy, it’s actually the first watch to be fully constructed in 18K plastic. Jokes aside, this watch (even the movement) was entirely made from plastic. 

Perhaps you’re an environmentalist, and plastic does you no good. Well, in 1985, to the soaring chants of hippies and geologists everywhere, Tissot released a rock watch. Well, the geologists would probably point out it’s more like a mineral watch since the materials offered included Alabaster, Aventurine, Basalt, Blue Lace (Agate), Blue Sodalite, Lapis Lazuli, Magnesite, Picture Jasper, Pink Rhodonite, Quartz, and Thulite, of which most are minerals and not rocks. 

Hell, in the 80s, Tissot even experimented with wood watches! Today, the brand has evolved slightly from simply using odd materials to being one of the top ‘entry level’ brands in the Swiss watch industry. Producing a wide range of watches ranging from cost-effective quartz options to open-heart mechanical options, there is a Tissot for most of us at most price points. 

What Makes Luxury Watches Hold Their Value?

You may have heard that luxury watches outperformed the S&P 500 in the last couple of years, and this is true. Depending on the watch you have (and a few other things), you might be sitting on a little goldmine. Here are some factors that will influence whether or not your watch will hold its value. 

Unique Design

There are about a dozen divers with a black dial, black bezel, and steel bracelet. Nothing of interest, yeah? Well, the price difference between a Rolex Submariner and a Rolex Submariner with the ‘Submariner’ text finished in red is about $20,000 – $40,000. 

Timepieces offering a unique design, be they small or large, will always catch the eyes of collectors and enthusiasts. These quirky watches might receive nicknames and stories that push the value even further. 

Watches like the famous ‘Red Sub’ have something that sets them apart. However, even timepieces that are not that rare could be presented with a certain attribute that could artificially increase the price. 

Case in point, the ‘Tiffany’ Casio. It’s a Casio, worth around $50 at retail; however, thanks to the ‘Tiffany’ blue dial, the watch reaches a hefty $200 on the second-hand market. It can be hard to just ‘see’ these design attributes if you do not know watches, so staying up to date with the industry could help you a lot as an investor. 

Story

As mentioned, a story can help increase the value of a watch infinitely. Who wore the watch? Why was it made? Is there controversial material? Most of the special gem-set Daytonas aren’t all that nice to look at.

Packed to the brim with gems with barely enough space to see your smug reflection in the gold. However, the ‘Nic Cage’ Daytona still carries a significant markup, partly in thanks to Mr. Cage and that sacred photograph taken so many years together. 

A story makes a watch seem alive and full of character, and people are always willing to pay slightly more for a good story and great character. 

Brand History

There is no denying the fact that the ‘Holy Trinity’ and the watches they make are extremely sought-after. Chances are, if you purchase one, then you might be able to sell it the next day for far more simply because it’s a Patek. 

A brand with significant history or a brand that now lies in the history books will always garner some extra cash. There might be models you could lose out on; however, these brands usually carry a significant markup over retail price. 

Exclusivity

Tying in with the brand of choice, we have the exclusivity of the brand or watch itself. Special edition? Well, guess that simply means people will be fighting to get their best offer in. Anniversary model? Put that bad boy in a safe, merely look at it, and laugh your way to the bank a few months later. 

The one thing to consider is that most of us are not exclusive enough people to be able to afford exclusive watches. Chances that a retailer will sell a ‘normal person’ a watch that was only produced 20 times are slim to none. 

Production Time 

Penultimately, how many were produced? This is different from exclusivity, as sometimes we see production runs end abruptly or changes made earlier than we thought. Case in point, the SeaDweller 4000 was merely produced for three years. 

While this is a normal sports watch in the catalog, you don’t see them every day. And things that we don’t see very often will always bring in more cash than run-of-the-mill things. 

Condition

Lastly, how well did you look after your watch? If it’s a vintage model with replaced hands and hour markers, you will lose value. If it’s a new model left in pristine condition, you won’t lose value. It’s a bit hard to tell what people want in this segment, but all you have to know is the same watch might have a $10,000 difference due to the condition. 

Do Tissot Watches Hold Their Value?

And finally, we get to the meat of the article. What is going to happen to the value of your Tissot? Chances are that your Tissot will lose value. 

That might be a sore pill to swallow, but when considering the factors laid out above, there really is no reason for your Tissot to increase in value at all. 

Some Tissots might have unique designs and stories, but these are limited to vintage models, mostly. You might come across the exception to the rule here and there, like the new ice blue PRX, but for the most part, it’s only vintage models which will hold or increase their value. 

Tissot is an exceptional brand, but they rarely offer exclusivity. Their market approach is to create affordable Swiss luxury. Once something becomes affordable, it’s far less likely to hold its value because why wouldn’t you just buy a new one? 

You do stand a chance to make some money if you consider selling it to a third-world country or on a social media site. The former is self-explanatory. Due to the exchange rate, you might be making all your money back; however, your client might be getting the deal of the week. 

The latter idea is something I’ve seen in person. Tissots being offered on Facebook at 90% of the retail price even though it’s clearly been worn for a while. And people buy them! What I have also noticed is the folks who do buy them are not clued up on watches and do not realize they’re not getting a great deal. 

Do Tissot Watches Appreciate In Value?

For the most part, no. I hate to be the person who brings you bad news, but you probably won’t be making your money back. There are a few exceptions to this rule, however. This doesn’t mean you’ll make all of your money back; however, you might make 90% of it back if you do your marketing correctly: 

  • PRX/PRX Chronograph: The hottest thing on the block (still), and for a good reason. You might make your money back on some of the more sought-after Powermatic version, or some of the Quartz options if you market to individuals who wouldn’t know the difference.
  • Le Locle: If you really take care of it and market it to folks who would really just want a beautiful (but Swiss) watch, this could be a decent investment.
  • Gentleman: A timeless classic that seems to hold value because it’s the do-it-all watch at a reasonable price. 

Making a return on any investment has to do with a certain amount of risk. When buying a Tissot, you aren’t taking a huge risk because there are about a dozen of the same model in the same shop. While they are amazing timepieces, they simply are not exclusive enough. 

What About Vintage Tissot Watches? 

We’ve mentioned that vintage watches will stand a far better chance of retaining their value, and a select few might even make you some cash. So, what about vintage Tissot watches? Are there any ones that held their value or increased in value? 

Reference 6216 Lemania chronograph

Most vintage chronograph Tissots will hold some value, and this ref. 6216 is a proper example. Released in the early to mid-40s as a co-development between Tissot and Lemania under the SSIH (Société Suisse pour l’Industrie Horlogére — Swiss Society for the Watch Industry) brand. A radium dial, large Arabic numerals, and an appropriately sized 35mm case make for a beautiful vintage piece that might retain its value. 

Tissot/Omega 33.3 Chronograph 

Omega was part of the same SSIH company and, along with Tissot, developed perhaps one of the most gorgeous vintage chronographs that don’t belong to one of the Holy Trinity. The large size of 40mm isn’t something we often see with watches from the 40s, and neither is the legendary chronograph movement called caliber 33.3 and made by Omega. 

Tissot Navigator 4002

The Navigator is perhaps one of the most well-known vintage Tissot models, and this ref. 4002 is one of the most sought-after. A world timer with a difference, and you merely need to look at it and understand why some folks are eager to dish out $20,000 for this bad boy. 

Conclusion 

Tissot is exceptional at what it does, which is being the first Swiss watch you can afford and feeling happy when you see the “SWISS MADE” on your wrist. Unfortunately, it’s unlikely that your watch will hold its value. 

While a new Tissot is very desirable, there is nothing about them that would make them desirable as a second-hand option. Sure, there might be a few contemporary options that hold value better than others; however, you should make peace with the fact that you’re buying a watch to be used.

Or, you might have one of the gorgeous vintage Tissot chronographs that have shot up in value well past $20,000. Will they keep climbing? Probably, seeing as the exclusivity will simply increase even more as time goes on. 

All this said, buy a watch you love. If you want to invest in watches, go ahead, but a Tissot is not a good investment for a monetary return. However, that Sky Blue PRX will look damn good with a suit.

BEST Seiko Pepsi Diver Watches

10 Best Seiko Pepsi Diver Watches (Pepsi Bezel On a Budget!)

Posted on by Daniel Louwrens

Seiko. We all know the Beast from the East and their ability to create some of the most respected and loved divers on the market, all at a great price. The Pepsi color scheme might have started with Rolex but has been adopted by various companies across the globe, including Seiko. Using this bi-color scheme along the bezel evokes a feeling of sportiness, but also vintage warmth due to the numerous old GMT Master Pepsi watches you’ve seen on Instagram. 

In case you don’t have around $20,000 to spend on a watch and you still want the Pepsi scheme, there might just be a Seiko to fit your wrist – literally. 

About Seiko Pepsi Diver Watches

Seiko didn’t originate as a watchmaking company but as a shop selling and repairing clocks in central Tokyo. After securing a factory in Tokyo, entrepreneur Kinato Hattori managed to create his first clock in 1892. 

The Seikosha factory (Seiko means “exquisite” or “success”) continued producing clocks for twenty-one years before veering into the world of pocket watches. In 1913, Seiko produced its first wristwatch called ‘The Laurel’, which also happened to be the first wristwatch made in Japan. 

The first dive watch made by Seiko saw daylight in 1965. A mechanical watch offering 150m of water resistance with extreme legibility and durability. In fact, the watch ended up being used in Antarctic explorations during the 60s. And since then, Seiko has been one of the leading innovators of dive watches. 

Should You Buy A Seiko Pepsi Diver Watch?

Yes! Absolutely! 

Well, if you’re not as impulsive as me, let me throw some facts at you. First and foremost, Seiko is one of the most cost-effective ways to get an automatic Pepsi watch. What’s more, you won’t be getting a timepiece that’s low quality. Hop on over to any SKX forum, and you’ll be met with thousands of pleased owners. 

One thing to note is that some of the older Seiko models do tend to be on the larger side. While this isn’t a cause of concern for most of us, Seiko has listened to its fans and slimmed down its contemporary offerings. 

Otherwise, if you like the design and can afford it, you cannot go wrong. It’s not a GMT-Master II Pepsi, but then again, you shouldn’t buy a Pepsi Seiko expecting that. It’s its own thing and should be judged appropriately. 

The Best Seiko Pepsi Divers You Can Buy

1. Seiko SKX009

In case you’re new to watches, the SKX is one of the most iconic watches on the planet. The SKX is no longer being produced, and unfortunately, the SKX prices have soared online. 

The SKX series was loosely based on the ref. 7002 and released in 1996. The SKX009 offers the wearer a 42mm steel case matched with the iconic red and blue bezel color combo. The 200m water resistance, impressive ISO 6425 certification, and in-house 7S26 movement create one of the best first watches you can get your hands on – or could’ve. 

As mentioned, the SKX range has been discontinued, and prices have been increasing steadily over the years. The matte blue-dialed Pepsi diver has become iconic over the years, but, unfortunately, its fame has made it less accessible to some of us. 

2. Seiko “Twilight Blue” SPB097

Seiko “Twilight Blue” SPB097

If you want something more contemporary compared to the SKX, perhaps this ref. SPB097 with a gorgeous light blue (or ‘Twilight Blue’) dial is the one for you. Sporting a 44mm polished steel case with a matching three-link bracelet. For improved wearability, the crown has been moved to the four o’clock position, similar to the SKX. 

The automatic 6R15 caliber powers the diver with a 50-hour power reserve and an accuracy of +25 to -15 seconds per day. The SPB097 dial layout keeps things classic, with a simple date aperture at 3 o’clock. The main attraction, of course, is the blue dial. The color works brilliantly with the Pepsi color combo on the bezel. Finishing things off with a 200m water resistance rating, the diver is a good option, even at the higher price of $1,150. 

3. Seiko “Sumo” SPB181

The ‘Sumo’ has been a beloved model since its introduction in 2007 and is called the ‘Sumo’ due to various design features like the large rounded case. The ref. SPB181 is part of the third generation and sports a 45mm polished steel case along with a matching three-link bracelet. 

45mm might seem extremely large; however, thanks to the snug 52.6mm lug-to-lug, it wears slightly smaller. Also, the crown has been moved to the 4 o’clock position to allow for better wearability. 

A black dial is matched with the recognizable Pepsi bezel, which is graded to 60 minutes, so you can use it to time your dives or how long your boss talks about his new GT3 RS. The trustworthy 6R35 caliber offers great timekeeping and 70 hours of power reserve. 

4. Seiko SSC795

Seiko SSC795

Someone once told me, “If you need to know the date while diving, you’re probably screwed”. The ref. SSC795 offers even more utility than just a date function with the addition of a 60-minute chronograph. What’s more, it’s a solar-powered watch.  

The solar caliber V192 allows the watch to work without you ever worrying about a power reserve or battery life. The 6 o’clock subregister displays a power reserve rated at 6 months when fully charged. But fear not; the screw-down crown does allow for 200m of water resistance, so you’ll still be able to go diving (or desk diving). 

This diver is relatively robust, 44.5m in diameter and 13.7mm thick, but the unidirectional Pepsi dive bezel does take up quite a lot of the real estate. This might be an excellent offering for those who are actually looking to go diving and need the ability to time two different events. 

5. Seiko “Turtle” SRPE99

Seiko “Turtle” SRPE99

“Alright, but I’m not going diving, I just want the look”. 

Perfectly understandable, and for you, a Pepsi ‘Turtle’ would be a great fit. Not the real nomenclature used by Seiko, but rather a nickname from the fans referring to the turtleback shape of the case. 

The case is sizable at 45mm but wears more like 44mm due to the smaller lug-to-lug profile. To increase wearability, the crown has been moved to the 4 o’clock position on account of the odd case shape. 

Behind the Hardlex crystal sits a blue dial that matches the blue of the Pepsi bezel. The large applied hour markers and hands are filled with LumiBrite for those late nights at the office (or pool). Of course, the automatic 4R36 caliber allows for a smooth second hand whilst also displaying the day and date. 

6. Seiko SNE591

Seiko SNE591

If the turtle shape isn’t likely to make an appearance in your watch box, perhaps something more classic like the ref. SNE591. Priced at just below $1,000 for a wearable and highly polished case with a reliable solar movement – not bad. 

The black dial is accentuated by large hour markers and hands as is traditional with Seiko divers but with the addition of a subtle date aperture at the 3 o’clock position. The Pepsi dial fits beautifully and is somewhat reminiscent of the SKX from years ago. 

7. Seiko “Samurai” SRPF09 

The ‘’Samurai’’ SRPF09 offers extremely great value, priced at $550 for one really attractive timepiece. Working from the inside out, we have the reliable 4R35 caliber taking care of time, offering 41 hours of power reserve as well as a date display. 

Moving onto the gem of the watch is the black dial with a gorgeous wave-like pattern. The minute hand is lined with red for a touch of sportiness in case the Pepsi bezel scheme wasn’t enough for you. 

A 43.8mm brushed steel case is matched with a screw-down crown with added knurling in case your immediate area becomes slippery. Matched with a steel three-link bracelet with a three-fold clasp. 

Another feature the keen-eyed viewer might have noticed is the ‘PADI’ scripture on the dial. This is in reference to the Professional Association of Diving Instructors, the world’s leading scuba diving training organization. Seiko has an official partnership with PADI. 

8. Seiko 5 SRPD53

Seiko 5 SRPD53

We mentioned the SKX multiple times already, and upon its discontinuation, fans were, predictably, distraught. Seiko hit back with the ‘5’ series, an affordable range of dive or tool watches that’ll look at home on the wrist of a teenager or seasoned diver who needs a beater. 

The ref. SRPD53 is priced at $325 for a reliable and trustworthy automatic watch, a deal if I ever saw one. The blue on the dial perfectly matches the blue on the Pepsi bezel identically, and the reliable 4R36 caliber takes care of timekeeping duties within.  Overall, a great overall package at a price point of entry that’s not prohibited to most. 

9. Seiko “Arnie” Pepsi SNJ027P1

Seiko “Arnie” Pepsi SNJ027P1

What’s 40 + 40? If you answered 100 you’re most like a gym bro. In case you are (or aren’t), you might be interested in a watch worn by the Terminator himself – the “Arnie” ref. SNJ027P1. The original model was worn by Arnold Schwarzenegger in Commando (1985) and Predator (1987) and has been a fan favorite since. 

The contemporary ref. SNJ027P1 is handsomely finished and priced at $500 and features the much beloved Pepsi bezel. As with other “Arnie’s”, the watch is large, 47.8mm in diameter, and 50.5mm lug-to-lug. Despite this, the watch is quite light at only 114g, thanks to the not-so-subtle use of rubber around the steel inner case. 

The movement within is the solar H851 caliber and offers quite a few features, including an alarm function, a 1/100-second chronograph, a calendar display on the digital register, and in case you need to find the choppa in the dark, a LED light as well. 

10. Seiko SSC783

Seiko SSC783

Rounding off the list, we have another robust chronograph sized at 43.5mm. The ref. SSC783 is presented with a blue dial and the all-famous Pepsi bezel scheme with a 60-minute grading. Large and full-bodied screw-down crowns allow for 200m of water resistance and, according to the Seiko website, are also good “for air diving”. 

The watch is powered by light thanks to the solar V175 caliber, granting the timepiece a theoretical power reserve of 6 months. The movement also displays various complications, including a chronograph, a 24-hour display, and a date function between the 4 and 5 o’clock position. 

Complimenting the steel case is a matching steel bracelet with brushed end links and polished center links, creating a nice dimension and luxurious touch. 

Conclusion

Quite a few options, right? Well, rather too many than too few, I always say. There is no doubt that the Pepsi scheme will keep on living on the bezels of watches ranging from luxurious options to more affordable Seiko’s seen in this list. 

With a variety of sizes, configurations, and dial colors, there is a Seiko Pepsi Diver for all of us. Whether you’re looking to go find Nemo or find your papers in your office drawer, have a look at the offering and just make sure to check the sizes, they tend to sneak up on ‘ya. 

Your Ultimate Guide to the Grey Market Watches

Your ULTIMATE Guide to the Gray Market Watches

Posted on by Daniel Louwrens

Had your eyes on that 126613LB Bluesy? Did you walk into your local authorized Rolex dealer only to be told, “For display only”? Well, welcome to the club. Finding a Rolex, Audemars Piguet, Patek Philippe, or even Vacheron Constantin at an actual authorized dealer will be harder than finding a … I’m struggling to find something rarer than that.

Due to the boom in watch popularity in 2020, it is nearly impossible to buy the watch you want without spending thousands on other watches first. I have been on the waiting list for a two-tone Sea-Dweller for three years, and even though I have given them plenty of ‘gifts’, nothing. There must be another way of getting the watch you want, right? Gray Market Watches.

About Gray Market Watches

The term ‘gray market’ is merely a term used to denote that the dealer is neither authorized nor selling black market products. This is a perfectly legal practice, so you needn’t be worried about legality issues. 

Gray market dealers will simply buy watches from collectors, retailers, and other dealers and resell them on their own site/platform. This is an incredibly common practice and allows buyers to ‘skip’ the waiting line we so often see at certain watch companies. 

The origin of gray market dealers isn’t really known; however, in 2019/2020, the watch industry saw a massive boom in second-hand market sales. Some estimate that sales doubled in the span of 18 months, and it wasn’t just with the gray market and private dealers. The Swiss watch industry reported a growth of 15.5% from 2019 to 2022 despite the pandemic. 

Part of this was due to social media. We cannot deny that rappers and professional sports athletes wearing luxury watches do not influence the market. Hell, we even nickname some watches after famous individuals. Then came the onslaught of individuals focused on investing rather than collecting. All of this meant the rise of the gray market dealer. 

Some of the more popular gray market dealers include Jomashop, an online site selling way more than just watches but also selling some other luxury products as well. Another popular one online is Luxury Bazaar, which sells more than just watches and is well known for its YouTube antics. 

Are Gray Market Watches Legit?

Right, the big one, the one you probably clicked on this article for, “Am I getting a legit product, or is my Rolex going to be a Nolex when it arrives?”. Great question, and the one you should be asking right out of the gate. If you’re about to drop $15K on a Submariner, you’d want to be sure it’s the real deal. 

It depends. Watches are often faked; there’s no surprise there. In fact, Havocscope estimates that 40 million counterfeit watches are sold globally each year (Havascope is an online database of black market activities). They also estimate the profits from these watches are close to a billion dollars each year. 

Case in point, a fake vintage Daytona ref. 6240 was almost sold on Accademia Fine Arts, a Monano-based Monégasque auction house, in 2019. Other images of the 6240 were used on the listing, and when confronted with the information that the Daytona was indeed fake, the auction house agreed to pull the listing. They didn’t, and the proven counterfeit still sold for a whopping EUR 78,000.

But the question still remains if the gray market watches are fake or not. It depends. What is key to understand is that a gray market dealer can buy from various sources, including: 

  • The actual company: If the watch company either has a boutique or sells their watches online. This isn’t extremely common, especially with high-end horology. That said, it would make sense to grab as many limited edition pieces as you can to resell later on when the demand has increased once again. 
  • Other dealers: This is another way gray market dealers buy and sell timepieces. If you know you have a client looking for a ref. 5711, you might ask your list of ‘friends’ if anyone has one at a price that makes sense for you, the other dealer, and your customer. Then, you simply purchase the watch and sell it to your client. 
  • From the public: This is the path that is most likely to yield ‘bad’ results for all parties involved. If the person is selling a fake watch and the dealer doesn’t pick up on this, then they might accidentally end up selling a fake watch. This does not happen that often, though.

It’s worth noting that not all gray market dealers are the same. Some only buy from watch companies, while others are happy to buy a watch from Joe halfway across the world. 

It’s somewhat important to know where your watch is actually coming from, but since you are buying it from a company and not someone off Facebook, you can contact them afterward to confront them if the watch is fake. 

Another reason you are likely to find real watches from these dealers is the fact that they will do everything they can to improve the value of the watch. Marketing, polishing, cleaning, research, etc. When you spend that much time (and money) on a watch, you are going to see if something is up.

So, for the most part, gray market watches are legit, and there are ways of sniffing out what’s real against what isn’t. One way to improve your chances of never getting a fake watch is actually connecting with the individuals in the company. Similar to how you would approach the owners and salespeople at an authorized dealer, if you’re nice to them, they end up being nice to you. 

You’re perhaps more likely to bargain with you and could even be more inclined to find a specific watch you are after. Consignment is not something every gray market dealer offers, but it’s a useful tool and a nice addition to the sales pitch. 

What to Look for When Buying Gray Market Watches

Obviously, various factors will influence your decision when choosing both the watch and the dealer. Let’s discuss some of these:

Buy the Dealer, Not the Watch

Have you noticed how frantic collectors and buyers are about boxes, papers, and serial numbers? That’s for good reason because that is how we judge how ‘real’ a watch is. Follow-up question, have you noticed that you might not always be able to tell a fake box from a real one? A fake warranty card from a real one? The thing is, most of us are very susceptible to ‘finding the perfect watch’ and overlooking glaring issues. Thus, buy the dealer. 

What this means is that you should do research on the dealer. Delve deep, read the reviews, contact previous clients, etc. There are so many things you can do to make sure the dealer is actually legit. A seller’s reputation will far precede themself, and doing a bit of digging will reveal whether or not you can actually trust the dealer. 

There are a couple of websites/destinations you can use to get more information on the dealer. 

  • Reddit: A great place to ask other buyers or people who have sold to the dealer. You can message the other folks on the forum but note that people can ‘fake’ stories by using a pseudonym.
  • Forums: Watch forums like Rolex Forums, Omega Forums, etc, which will give you some information on the dealer (if they are large enough). You won’t always find the information you need on these forums; however, it’s worth a shot. 
  • Social Media: Websites like Instagram and Facebook might be able to give you relevant information. Most likely the dealer will have some kind of social media presence and if things look fishy or too good to be true, you need to be careful.
  • (Unlikely) Word of Mouth: If you are very well connected in the watch world, you might be able to ask your horologically-inclined friends whether or not the dealer you’re about to approach is legit.

Another useful tool often overlooked is the ‘Authorized’ logo that some websites give. Chrono24 is a massive online watch sales site that allows private and gray market dealers to sell watches. If you are deemed ‘good enough’ by the company and by past clients, only then will you receive the ‘Authorized’ marking, making you far more trustworthy to potential clients. 

And, if possible, go see the dealer. Talk to them, see what they’re about. Talk about movements, the last Watches and Wonders, etc. This might not give you specific data, but sometimes trusting your gut is the best thing you can do. 

What’s Included in the Sale

As mentioned before, watches are usually sold as a ‘lot’ which includes the watch, box, and papers (warranty and booklets). Other things that might be included in the lot are extra straps, strap-changing tools, a loupe, a watch cloth, a screw-down caseback, etc.

The possibilities are endless, really; I’ve seen watches with lots so large you get tired of reading them. A good starting place is going to the manufacturer’s site and seeing what is usually included in the lot.

Alternatively, you can look at other listings on other sites like Chrono24 to see what a ‘Full Set’ would consist of. It’s not a massive red flag if the lot doesn’t include everything usually sold with the watch; however, take precautions and use common sense. 

Quality of the Watch

On to the biggie – what does the watch actually look like? Typically, companies will use a grading scale to determine the quality of a watch. These can differ from vendor to vendor; here’s an example: 

  • AAA: Completely unworn and like new 
  • AA: May have been lightly worn/retail handling. May have light marks.
  • A: Worn. Marks, but not significant.
  • B: Significant marks which may not be removable.
  • C: Heavily worn. Significant marks/dents which may not be removable.
  • Vintage: Signs of wear and visible imperfections commensurate with age. Replacement components and case refinishing may be evident, and movement may not be running to the original specification.

Have a look at the watch. Scratches along the bracelet and clasp are incredibly common. Deeper scratches might be harder to remove with polishing, and deep scratches on the crystal are a big no-no – unless the price is right. 

Having a watch polished won’t be too expensive, but the costs add up. If they are expecting the same money from a mint watch as one that’s been banged up, they are being silly. Not uncommon in the watch world… 

It’s impossible for you to see if the movement is working well, but some companies do specify whether or not the movement is working well. Movements can cost a pretty penny to have serviced, and opting for a watch that already has a good movement will save you a lot of trouble. This leads me to the next point.

Is the Watch Serviced?

According to SwissWatchExpo, a watch service can cost anything between $600 and $1200. Again, not a huge cost, but if you’re buying a nice PRX for $450 second-hand and you have to pay another $200 for a service… See what I mean? 

When purchasing a watch from a gray market dealer, you have to look at all the costs associated that an authorized dealer would just include in the final sale. A service, polishing, shipping, these things do add up.

Plus, if you are purchasing from across the border, you’ll be paying import taxes as well. And if you do have the watch shipped, you rush down the stairs to collect the box, and you open the box in angst only to find… it’s fake? What then?

Stop Buying Fake Watches

Fake watches are rampant in the world, and there’s not much we can do about it. But you can make sure you don’t buy a watch that is fake. This is especially common in the vintage segment as vintage watches can carry huge price tags and everyone is looking to make a quick buck. 

There are numerous guides online on how to spot a fake timepiece, and you have to be sure the watch you’re investing in isn’t fake. Here are some factors to look at where con artists usually make mistakes: 

  • Date windows will often be the wrong color, wrong font, or wrong font size 
  • Finishing along the case and bracelet will be shoddy and poor 
  • Movement finishing (might) be visible if the model has a sapphire caseback 
  • Font on the dial might have minor imperfections 
  • Certain markings on the lugs, caseback, and bracelet can sometimes be forgotten 

And then lastly, serial numbers. It’s not often that a dealer will share these, but if they are willing to do so, you have a one-way ticket to see if the watch is actually real or not. 

Consider the Price

Price will be one of, if not the biggest factor when purchasing a watch. Right off the bat, we know that if something appears too good to be true, it probably is. That John Player Special Daytona you found for only $100K might be more Nolex than Rolex. 

There are no precise guides on what a watch will or should cost since the market determines that; however, you can look at sites like Chrono24 and WatchAnalytics to find the ballpark of what the watch is worth. Take note that a watch sold by a private vendor will always be slightly cheaper due to fewer ‘fees’ needing to be paid – this lower price, of course, comes with an increased risk of buying a fake watch. 

Are They in a Great Hurry? 

Ever noticed those sales that have to happen today or … I’m not quite sure what happens if the sale doesn’t happen today, actually. Usually, these people are looking to scam you and are using sales tactics to try and allure you. It’s extremely unlikely that a real gray market vendor will ever do this, they’ll just run a regular discount/sale on a watch, so, if you see a ‘Must Sell Today!” take caution and do plenty of research. 

Dealers that ‘Specialize’

You’ll sometimes come across a gray market dealer that specializes in a certain style or type of watch – typically vintage offerings. These incredibly hard-working and precise individuals go to painstaking measures to ensure the watches they get their hands on are real.

If you are buying a high-value or vintage piece, you need to do even more research. You have to compare photos of your offering vs. real iterations, and you might need to use the ‘zoom’ function a lot. It wouldn’t hurt to also have someone to discuss this with. All in all, the more value a watch carries, the more likely someone is to fake it. 

Gray Market vs Authorized Dealers

As mentioned, there are two kinds of dealers which you can purchase from; three if you count boutiques as well. Gray Market dealers and Authorized dealers are vastly different from one another, so let’s delve into some of the key differences that might influence your purchase. 

Watch Availability

Let’s face it you probably have been on the waiting list, or you’ve heard the words “Sorry, no stock” for way too long. There has been a mountain of cries from fans and collectors that authorized dealers should stop this silliness and just sell to the person who shows up first (I’ll admit, I am one of them). 

In case you are not aware, certain watch companies have been putting good folks on waiting lists. The problem is these are not really waiting lists. The way it works is they sell to their ‘best friends’, the people who have spent the most money at their company.

This would mean you need to purchase several other watches before you get the one you want. Gray market dealers, on the other hand, have no alliance. No flag. No ‘best friends’. Money talks, and the one who shows up first wins. 

Another factor to consider is that authorized dealers don’t stock vintage watches, and if the limited editions are sold out tough luck. Gray market dealers have the ability to stock any and every watch they please – even a one-of-one. This, of course, does mean they can ask slightly more, but it’s the price we pay for not waiting 5 years. 

Pricing

To follow what I just hinted at, gray market dealers do charge more than authorized dealers. Let’s look at an example, the Bluesy Rolex ref. 126613LB, 2023, unworn. Retail price sits at $15,600, while you might be expected to pay $18,288 at a gray market dealer while you would (perhaps) pay $17,553 at a private dealer. 

Let’s look at an example that has risen in price so much that it becomes questionable – the Patek Philippe 5711/1R. The retail price sits at $59,140 (as of Dec 2021), while the market price is estimated to be $190,088! 

There is no getting around the fact that the watch market has exploded since 2020, and, unfortunately, this has made plenty of models inaccessible to most of us. It has been dying down the last few months, but you can expect to pay 10 – 100% more than retail. 

Authenticity

We have gone down the rabbit hole of fake watches before, but just to double down on what we mentioned earlier, gray market dealers do run the risk of accidentally selling a fake watch. This is unlikely, especially if you opt for a trustworthy dealer. 

This will never be the case with an authorized dealer – unless you purchase a watch out of a suspiciously marked van… Jokes aside, authorized dealers will sell you the real deal. This includes everything that should be included in the lot as well – box, outside sleeve, papers, swing tags, etc. 

Warranty 

As mentioned before, the repair on a watch can run you a pretty penny. If you bump your watch three days after purchasing it, you will wish you had a warranty. The problem is that most gray market dealers do not offer a warranty. However, there are some that do. Some gray market dealers offer a warranty on the movement or the entire watch. 

You will (probably) get a warranty from an authorized dealer. These may vary from two up to eight years and typically covers most types of damage. Most movements will only need to be serviced after ten years, but the warranty gives you peace of mind in case the watch gets a booboo. 

‘Who are You?’ 

While I hate mentioning it, if you are to buy from an authorized dealer, you are more likely to be able to purchase a higher-value watch from them in the future. Authorized dealers ‘guard’ their best pieces for their best clients, and while this is completely unethical, I get it.

If you are going to buy from your local authorized dealer, they will probably place you higher on the ‘waiting list’ than you currently are. Of course, this isn’t really a good thing if watch A isn’t a watch you really wanted, but it’s worth mentioning. 

It’s worth mentioning because gray market dealers usually carry a markup on the watches due to market value. The market value is solely determined by how little patience you have before you need the watch you really want. If you are looking to make a turnover on watches and perhaps look at investing, this is probably the way to go. 

You might need to purchase a few lower-value watches before buying something that makes sense economically; however, with second-hand watches beating the S&P 500 in the last couple of years, it will be worth it in the end. Just make sure to buy the right ones… 

Should you Buy Gray Market Watches?

Let’s cut to the chase – should you buy a gray market watch? Well, it depends. While there are slight risks and some nuances to the transaction, there are certain situations where it would be far better to go for a gray market option:

  • Limited edition watches that have been sold out from your local authorized dealer will only be available at a gray market dealer. You might still need to do a lot of research to find it, and you might even need to ask them to find it for you, but it is possible. 
  • If your authorized dealer isn’t playing nice then you might need to resort to a gray market dealer because you have to. Do your research prior and make sure you have a trusted dealer and the watch is real. 
  • Watches that are in high demand might also be hard to find at your local authorized dealer. Case in point, I haven’t seen a Tudor Black Bay Pro at my local authorized dealer in 8 months because they never have stock. If I want one, I would need to find one at a gray market dealer and be willing to perhaps pay an inflated price due to high demand.
  • If the watch is no longer being produced or, in other words, a vintage timepiece, then you might need to resort to a gray market dealer – they tend to be slightly safer than going to a private dealer. 

If you are looking for that ‘AAA’ option and you need to continue or start building a relationship with your local authorized dealer, then going to the gray market dealer would (obviously) be the second choice. Just know that authorized dealers do have their own drawbacks and benefits: 

  • Sure, you might wait longer but you get the real deal which means you can sleep easily at night knowing your watch is 100% real. 
  • You get the added benefit of a warranty period but keep in mind that plenty of gray market dealers have their own warranty protocol as well.
  • You build a relationship that allows you to purchase ‘bigger’ watches in the future. This isn’t likely to happen with a gray market dealer, but they might be able to give you a better price if you continue coming back to them time after time. Gray market dealers that know you are also more likely to offer you investment pieces before they offer them to the public because they’re helping someone who helps them.

In the end, the decision lies with you. For plenty of us, there is no other way but going through a gray market dealer – thank you waiting lists. All you need to do is ensure that the dealer is trustworthy and the watch itself is legit – no pressure.

Conclusion

Gray market dealers are an excellent way of getting the piece you want – now. They are also able to sell you discontinued or vintage options as well, something no authorized dealer ever will. That said, there is an inherent risk with buying from a gray market dealer, the risks being that the company isn’t trustworthy and the watch might be fake. 

Thus, when considering a gray market approach, you need to do a lot of research prior to putting down your $7K for that Speedy. It’s not often that you will get robbed, it’s far more likely with a private seller, but be vigilant.

Above all, ask and ask once more. Ask for references, reviews, images, serial numbers, and anything else you can think of. Knowledge is power in this case. So, call up your local Gray market dealer and tell ‘em you’re ready for your ‘Sub; you’re done waiting for a call; you are the one who calls now! 

rolex kermit vs hulk

Rolex Kermit vs Hulk: Which Green Beast Should YOU Buy?

Posted on by Daniel Louwrens

The color green and Rolex go hand in hand; this couldn’t be more true than with the Submariner Kermit and Hulk. They have odd names and are surely not named like that by the brand, but everyone in the community knows these models by these names. 

Regardless, both of these have gained legendary status amongst collectors, celebrities, and enthusiasts alike. But which one is right for you? 

About the Rolex Kermit

The Rolex Kermit or Submariner ref. 16610LV was released in 2003 for the 50th anniversary of the Rolex Submariner, which initially debuted in 1953. The use of color along the bezel was only reserved for GMT Masters at this point, but the Kermit broke the mold with the introduction of a green aluminum bezel matched with a black dial. 

It sported the same compact 40mm case with a 13mm thickness and ‘maxi-dial’ style, which, of course, increases visibility through the use of larger hands and markers. Within the 300m waterproof case was the Rolex caliber 3135, a chronometer-certified movement also used in the other Subs. 

Throughout the 7-year production, there were slight changes to the Kermit. The main being the ‘Flat 4’, a name given to Kermits with a flat-headed ‘4’ on the bezel. These would also have an olive-green colored bezel and got the nickname ‘Bertolli’ for the olive oil brand.

The Kermit remained in production until 2010, before it was discontinued and replaced with the Rolex ref. 116610LV, Hulk. The Kermit was rereleased in 2020 as the ref. 126610LV, but many in the community gave it a new nickname like Starbucks or Cermit (pronounced ‘shermit’ to denote its ceramic bezel). 

About the Rolex Hulk

As mentioned, the Rolex Hulk ref. 116610LV was released in 2010 to replace the outgoing Kermit ref. 16610LV. The case remained unchanged in dimensions. Technically, however, it did offer more wrist presence thanks to the large squared-off lugs synonymous with modern Rolex design.

The bezel was still a handsome green, but now the dial was as well, polarizing to some and gorgeous to others. The bezel was now finished with a ceramic insert allowing for more scratch resistance. The movement remained unchanged, and the watch still retained its durability and 300m waterproofness. 

This spiritual successor to the original Kermit remained in production until 2020, when it was discontinued and replaced with the newer Kermit ref. 126610LV. 

Rolex Kermit vs Hulk: Which One Should You Choose

And here we come to the bulk of the situation, the mainspring of the movement, the crystal of the case, and the lume to the bezel. Which one of these two (three) Rolex Submariner offerings would be the best for you? There are various things to consider ranging from pure aesthetics to pricing and availability. 

We will be looking at all three options, even though two of them have the same name. For reference, the 16610LV is the ‘Kermit’, and the 126610LV is the ‘Kermit 2.0’. Again, some people prefer Starbucks, but since Rolex itself doesn’t name these, we can technically call these whatever we want. 

And before we delve in, please remember to buy the watch you want. Do not be influenced by dealers, marketing, or arguments online. Buy a timepiece that tells you more than just the time. 

Appearance

Starting with the Kermit, we have a peculiar mix of a black ‘maxi-dial’ and a striking green aluminum bezel insert. This green is, of course, a subtle nod to the color of the Crown, but even so, for some, this blend was too much – at the time. Since then, watch design has developed and evolved, and we even saw a Day-Date featuring emojis in 2023! 

The Kermit was the first to push the tone changes of the Submariner, and there are even different bezel hues in the production run of 7 years. In fact, there are no less than six and five variations for the dial and bezel, respectively. Some of the most sought-after include the MK 1 with the ‘Flat 4’ bezel design and wide ‘O’ in the word “ROLEX”. We have the olive-green colored bezel options nicknamed ‘Bertolli’ for the olive oil brand. 

The case design might not be to everyone’s liking, seeing as these earlier models might seem small compared to more contemporary dive options. That said, if you prefer a lean, mean, and green machine, the 16610LV Kermit is definitely for you. 

Moving onto the 2010s, we have the release of the 116610LV Hulk. Named after the big green hero from Marvel, this Sub doubled down on green and exchanged the black dial for a sunburst green one. Again, upon the release, the public wasn’t completely sold, but as time has passed, most have come to love the Hulk, and it has been worn by numerous celebs like Zlatan Ibrahimovic, Erling Haaland, and Jonah Hill. 

The bezel color and material were updated, being a richer green and made from ceramic (Cerachrom). Both cases measure 40mm in diameter. However, the Hulk featured the “Rolex Super Case”, meaning it has significantly broader lugs and crown guards. This is when the diameter doesn’t really tell the full story, as the Hulk appears far more chunkier and angular than its predecessor. 

The Hulk also saw an update on the bracelet with the addition of an Oysterlock safety clasp with a Glidelock extension system, allowing for 2mm increment adjustments without the use of tools. The Kermit, however, has the classic Oysterlock clasp. 

And in 2020, we had the release of the Kermit 2.0 (and a slight update in 2023 as well). The Kermit 2.0 went back to its roots with the reintroduction of a black dial, but the bezel remained the same as on the Hulk. 

However, this was slightly revised in 2023 when the (unofficial) MK 2 Kermit 2.0 debuted with a darker hue of green along the bezel. This was a slight adjustment, and many didn’t even notice it; but it makes the MK 1 Kermit 2.0 somewhat rare as it was only produced from September 2020 to May 2023. 

Regardless, the youngest green Submariner had some other tricks up its sleeve as well. It gained a millimeter in width, now measuring a heft 41mm. The lug width had grown to 21mm but also featured slimmer lugs overall. These design changes have made the latest generations of Submariners wear a lot smaller and more comfortable than their predecessors. 

Movements

Rolex is known for using some of the most reliable and precise movements in the horological market. All modern Rolex movements have passed COSC and are known to keep ticking for decades if you look after your timepiece. 

The Kermit was introduced with the Rolex caliber 3135. These movements form part of the 3035 movement system, which was introduced in 1977. The cal. 3135 was introduced in 1988 with 31 jewels, and thanks to a duo-directional rotor, it had a power reserve of 48 hours.

It also featured a frequency of 28.800 BPH and was renowned for its reliability. The cal. 3135 is also the brand’s longest-serving movement. In fact, the 116610LV Hulk featured the same movement. 

The only change in movements came with the introduction of the 126610LV Kermit 2.0. The cal. 3135 was introduced in 2015 and featured in other models, like the Datejust, Sea-Dweller, and Deepsea Sea-Dweller. 

Rolex themselves state that over 90% of Caliber 3235’s parts are new and are protected by numerous patents, 14 to be exact. It offers Chronergy Escapement, which is a longer mainspring housed inside a barrel with thinner walls offering better efficiency. This increased the power reserve to 70 hours while retaining the same dimensions as the 3135. 

The cal. 3125 also has Paraflex shock absorbers allowing for better robustness, and a monoblock rotor, which also helps with the increased power reserve. 

Price & Availability

In case you’re not so great at reading dates, you can no longer purchase the 16610LV Kermit and 116610LV Hulk from Rolex themselves unless you go through the ‘Rolex® Certified Pre-Owned’ route. Thus, for most of us looking to purchase one of the older generations, we would need to look at the gray market or private collectors. 

In recent years we have seen a huge spike in watch prices which, unfortunately, prohibits most timepieces from many enthusiasts. Let’s look at the prices of the three different models, of course, without taking full sets, conditioning, etc, into account. These are the average prices we see being used.

Kermit 16610LV

Kermit 16610LV
  • Retail (at launch) $5,000 
  • Market price (today): Upwards of $14,000
  • Market price (today) for a ‘Flat 4’: Upwards of $16,000

The Kermit will most likely increase with value as time goes on – especially the sought-after versions. While the prices are currently being corrected after the 2020 boom, the trajectory is looking upward for investors overall. 

Hulk 16610LV

Hulk 16610LV
  • Retail (at launch) $8,500 
  • Market price (today): Upwards of $18,500

Again, it’s highly expected that the Hulk will also keep increasing in price once the prices have corrected. While the Kermit might be a better buy right now, it would also stand to be the one that might be more collectible in the future, seeing as it was one of the last Subs to feature a steel bezel. 

The current 126610LV retails for $14,350, but you can expect to pay a premium on the market, closer to $17,000. Still slightly more affordable than the Hulk because you can still get it – but for how long?…  

Value Retention & Investment

We were all waiting anxiously in 2023 for the update to the Submariner, seeing as it was celebrating its 60th anniversary. What were we going to get? A platinum or titanium model? A baby blue bezel? The discontinuation of the Kermit 2.0?! 

Well, we got nothing. 

Nada. 

Zero changes whatsoever (to the Submariner, at least). 

This is where speculation and trends meet ends. Many believe that the Kermit 2.0 is not long for this world and will soon be resigned to the history books. This, as always, creates a massive opportunity for folks to gather as many as possible and save some coffee for a rainy day. We, of course, know that Rolex models hold (and almost always gain) value with time, so investing in watches is what many folks end up doing. But which do you go for? 

The Kermit will always be the first and currently offers the greatest return on investment, but only if you bought it at retail when it was available. In the current market, it is a great offering but is also subject to fakes, especially the ‘Flat 4’ models. With vintage watches, you have to be slightly more careful, and factors like polishing and what’s included in the lot can influence the prices substantially. 

That said, the Kermit 1.0 has shown great returns, but only if you get it at the right price. The same can be said of the Hulk, which is hitting the sweet spot for adults who finally have a bit of money to spend. They were assistants when the Hulk debuted, and now they’ve been promoted and have a larger paycheck. They fell in love with the green monster and are now willing to spend their hard-earned cash – because they can. 

This is perhaps why the Hulk is fetching a slightly higher price than expected at the movement. It’s also unlikely that the green-on-green color scheme will be used on the Sub again, but time will tell. 

The Kermit 2.0 is still being produced by Rolex and will not present a similar return on investment as the aforementioned models. The reason being, well, anyone can still get one (well, not everyone…). And this is where you might be able to make some money! If you can get it from an authorized dealer, you can still make a return if you sell it immediately. 

However, if we are to follow the trends of every single other sports model produced by the Crown, you will see an even greater return if you put your Kermit 2.0 away for a couple of years, especially ‘till after it’s been discontinued – just look at what happened to the Milgauss in 2023. 

Conclusion

Rolex green is a green like no other. It exudes opulence, and for those of us who know, it means business, style, and reliability, factors we do not often see coming together in the modern world. The use of green on Rolex models has grown exponentially from just the green sapphire on the Milgauss to a full green Hulk Submariner. 

Currently, the Starbucks is carrying the torch for the lunette verte models of the Crown, and it’s doing a damn good job. Loved by most but respected by all. That said, if you prefer your green machine a bit leaner or even greener, there is always the original Kermit or the discontinued Hulk. 

Whichever you go for, it’s bound to make you smile and draw attention – the good kind.

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